Death or Dinner: Tom Radford on Foraging and Finding Your Way Back to Nature

Tom Radford of Eat the Country speaks to Mind Cakers

Lee: Hello, mind cakers, and welcome to another slice of. Well, not cake this week. More hedgerow. As we speak to Tom Radford of Eat the Country. Tom, how are you?

Tom Radford: I'm, very well, sir. How are you?

Lee: I'm good. How is. How is sunny Dorset?

Tom Radford: Well, not sunny. I'm up in, the. One of the hills, above. Well, actually, I'm not sure. I suppose I'm in sort of in the north, west of Dorset, and a place called Bulbarrow Hill, and parks in my van. I have a beautiful view across the Dorset countryside from here. But it is, yes, kind of, somewhat rainy, I'm afraid.

Lee: Yes.

Tom Radford: Summer's stuttering on its way, isn't it? It is, yes.

Lee: No, I don't feel so bad. It's very gloomy up in, near Loch Lomond as well. So, One of the things I hadn't actually written down to speak to you about, but I always used to get messages from my mom going, oh, it's lovely and sunny in Bournemouth. I was like, I'm not. I'm watching the game on the telly. And it's really. It's really not. I don't know if you're into the football, but I did, I did watch the game last night. We're born with getting into Europe, but that's probably a different conversation.

Tom Radford: Well, I'm from. I'm. I went to school in Southampton, so I tend to avoid football because it's just too stressful. I don't know whether they've made it back up into the premiership. Someone muttered to me about it the other day. And of course, I've got a friend of mine who's a Gooner, and he's been celebrating them winning the championship. So I'm like, no, you can all go away. I'm. I'm going to hang out with the. In the bushes instead. It's less stressful.

Lee: Yes, Very, very wise. Especially I think Southampton have been banned.

Tom Radford: Have they be. Have they been banned?

Lee: I think they've been banned for spying. Yes. Apparently they were spying on the opposition's training. I don't know much about it, but I've just. What? I've read in the headlines that, yeah, they've been. They've been chucked out the playoffs because they were.

Tom Radford: That sounds incredibly tenuous to me, but. Yeah.

Lee: Yeah.

Tom Radford: Anyway. Another fantastic chapter in the history of Southampton Football Club.

Lee: Yes, exactly.

Tom has become addicted to foraging after leaving corporate communication roles

So, Tom, how does a bloke leave corporate communication roles and end up wandering through fields, teaching People how to eat greenery.

Tom Radford: Oh, well, that's not a, that's not a long question. well, basically m. my life has been. I've never really had a career of any kind. I sort of, I worked in it for a long time. I did a bit of foraging as a kid, and I grew up in the New Forest but did. It didn't play a massive part in my life. I always sort of kept my hand in. But then I got married, all those things and then I ended up in Singapore, for six years where my, Well, I got a job as a creative director. I blagged my way into that, didn't know what I was doing. somehow, ah, I found a job where you just make stuff up all day long. I thought, well this is good. So I was directing commercials and things came back to the uk, covered. Divorced. there wasn't much to do. I wanted to do something film wise. so I thought I'll do social media, I'll just get some Instagram stuff going. And I, I literally was stuck in London. So I got to Wandsworth Common and do Death or Dinner with any kind of plants I could find and, and it actually sort of did quite well online. I thought, okay, well this is quite interesting. And so when when I got the opportunity to get out of London, I got myself a a camper van or something similar. And you know, obviously once you're, once you're doing things in foraging, I mean foraging is not a massively lucrative thing. But then what do you do? The next step is to maybe start taking people on some walks. so I started doing that, which is a bit scary to start with because whilst it is very fun, you are sort of playing with life and death. So you've got to kind of know what you're doing. Yeah, but, but since then I've been really enjoying it. I mean I, you know, it's, it's my eyes. I do content stuff for a couple of clients as well. It's not a full time business yet, but I take people on walks. I do walks with various hotels and things and I think that taking people out into the countryside and showing them what is edible and what isn't, that look on the amazement on their face when you tell them something's medicine or food or poisonous or whatever, it's just worth it for that. I, absolutely. And I'm, I've got, become completely addicted to foraging.

Lee: Well, I can, I can see why because I've like I said, I Randomly came across you on Instagram and I've been looking at your posts and reading your posts, posts. And I am, dog sitting this week, which has made me walk down the cycle path more than I would do normally. And I found myself looking at. And I very nearly sent you a picture. Is this edible? And is this edible? And because I googled it, I'd taken a picture and googled it and it said, well, it might be this and can you, you know, rub the flowers? And it's supposed to smell of something or other. And I, and, and I did notice. And I suppose from a mental health perspective, one of my questions was going to be, is foraging really about food or is it actually about paying attention?

Tom Radford: I'm not going to make a joke about psychopaths and mental healths. but. Or psychopaths, but, is it about food? I mean, it can be. what I always say to people is foraging is not your replacement for your Sainsbury Shop. You know, you don't go out there. I mean, oh, if everyone started foraging, we'd have no plants. It's not really about that thing about, it really is, it's about empowerment, in anything. You feeling comfortable in nature, Walking out in nature, knowing what things are, knowing the storeys and the folklore behind them, means that from a mental health perspective, if you are walking out and you feel lonely when you go on a walk, I would say I no longer feel lonely in nature because I'm surrounded by all these storeys. So I always feel kind of out with my friends in a strange sort of way. But paying attention is very important too. I mean, I always say you get like a bit of a crook in the neck when you're a forager because you're always kind of looking at the floor or looking for mushrooms and things like that. And if you see something you don't recognise, why are you. Then let's find out about that for sure. There's plenty of things you can eat, but I often start the, the walk by saying, I don't want to disappoint Everybody but you. 95 of this stuff is just a substitute for spinach, you see. I mean, there are gourmet things out there. There are some nice tasting things, but a lot of it is basically just good lawn. But could I survive? Yeah, I would be miserable. Probably end up stealing a cow or something, but I'd be, I could survive. But also, it's also a way of connecting to your ancestors. And, you know, two, 300 years ago, people would have had to know this stuff. Yeah. So I think in every man's mind there's a kind of what would. If it was World War iii, would I be able to survive? Isn't there? Ever since, as a kid, I've always had that, you know, in the back of my mind. So I, I, when I got into this, you know, that, that idea of being able to off grid and be able to, you know, to go out there and be the sort of the hunter gatherer M is. Is always quite exciting. but I think it's, it is really about, in terms of identification of plants. It's very much about observation. You, you know, you'd be amazed the, the two leaves the same but two stems are different or two flowers are different or the smell is different. and after a while you start to, what I say, just decipher the green and it actually starts to come alive.

Lee: Yeah.

Tom Radford: and that's a fantastic feeling.

Lee: Definitely.

What's the line between folk wisdom and actual useful plant knowledge

I suppose, without sounding all Gwyneth Paltrow, what's the line between sort of folk wisdom and actual useful plant knowledge? I'm thinking, you know, we hear a lot about St. John's Wort. I'm thinking, particularly for mental health, nettles, wild garlic, that sort of thing.

Tom Radford: There's a lot of guff talked about wild plants and nature and stuff. And I'm in, in no way am I a hippie. I do come across, I mean, you know, the amount of hippies and witches and things. I know all lovely people and people have different amounts of faith what plants can do than others. I tend to stick to the plants I know have guaranteed. If I'm talking about medicine, I like to talk folklore. I mean, you know, I mean, there's a wonderful plant called south thistle, for example, which there's, a thing called the doctrine of signatures. If something looks like something people thought in the past, that's what it did. So south thistle has a milky SAP and the storey goes that if you rub that onto the nipples of pigs, it will make them lactate. my question is, how did you arrive at this? What were you doing with the pigs and long, lonely evenings in Saxon England? Is there any truth in it? Well, there is, because actually antibacterials, they're probably using it for mastitis. So there probably is a bit of truth in it. you're right. John's wort. I mean, the thing about Sir John's wort, it's actually quite poisonous. You shouldn't eat it unless you know what you're doing. All these substances are derivative. I mean, salicyn, which comes from willow and meadow sweet and things, that's a painkiller. And chamomile, if you were talking about mental health, chamomile for calming down and things like that. And obviously you have read recently amazing, research around psilocybin. there's obviously coming from mushrooms. There was a research out of Oxford, I think, where they're dealing with, pardon me, cyclical disorders like depression. Psilocybin, has been proving unbelievably effective, for a lot of people. But, yes, you, you, you have to take it with a pinch of salt with a lot of these things. I like the colour and the ideas and the fun that goes with some of these things. But, I'm very quick to point out that, you know, this plant is supposed to cure tumours. And I think, well, you mustn't give, you know, all about this. You mustn't give false hope to people. But then you have a plant like, Herb, Robert, which has the rather unfortunate moniker of Stinking Bob because it smells a bit like burnt rubber. But that's been used very effectively in some cancer treatments because it's got full of antioxidants. There's a big argument at the moment around turkey tail mushrooms. You know, the government have just reclassified them. It's caused all this hassle. But actually, for example, in Japan, where the medicine is world class, it's almost prescribed as a thing of matter, of course, with certain cancer, you know, just jumping in there.

Lee: Why do you think that is? Because I was at this wellness festival and there was this stall that was doing mushroom gummies or whatever they were, and they did turkey tail and they said, if you want to get them, get them quick because soon they're going to be. I don't. Ban's too strong a word. But you can't, you can't get them in the uk. I mean, what, what was the.

Tom Radford: Well, it's not that they're banned, you can't, because people can't sell them anymore. what's happened is they've been reclassified as what's called a novel food. Both turkey tails and cordyceps, which are very popular treatments people love and, you know, obvious what you. Whether you think is effective for you or not is another matter. But a lot of people like these products and they claim that they are and they're well entitled to. And so the government have just found this loophole where it says, oh, these Things are, novel foods, which means that they aren't consumed in a sufficient amount to be classified as, as real foods. It's a loophole, the sort of loophole that a company like Unilever could just like a drop in the ocean legally get around. But small companies produce these things. And there's a company that I, I work with called Moco Farm, they have to give it away for free. Now they spent all this time developing all these beautifully packaging them and they have to give away turkey tails for free with other products because the government won't let them sell them to me. That makes me a bit cross because, you know, there is plenty of evidence about turkey tails and cordyceps. you know, it's not a wonder cure, but it, what the, the net result typically is that small businesses in this country end up getting walloped. And what a surprise. Another, Another entrepreneurial idea because it's a little bit woo and a little bit different and, and, and, and I would not be surprised if two years time I see that Unilever or someone like that has suddenly produced one that you see on the shel. I mean, that's cynical. But yeah, who knows, you know?

Lee: Well, yes, I think you're probably right on that one.

We did an episode about bee therapy on The Hardwick Show

Talking of small, businesses or whatever, we did do an episode about bee therapy.

Tom Radford: Did you say bee therapy? Yeah, I have heard. I mean, there's all sorts of bizarre people stinging their lips with bee stings these days. All sorts of bizarre things. but I would be an advocate of it because I, Last year I did beekeeping for a year with a friend and I found them enormously therapeutic. I, I would go down in the morning with a cup of tea and talk to them. There's something fantastically selfless about bees. they just get on and they, they live six weeks, they die, and they produce honey, which I think is one of the greatest things that nature can give us. You know, we don't. As long as you don't take it all and leave plenty bees. But there's, but they, Interestingly, they, they get used to you. So you, Once they know your smell, you can get really close to the hive without any problems. And I found this out. The Hardwick support my son along to show him, and he got stung immediately. so the bees, you have a kind of a harmony with them. And I think it's, I think that it would absolutely be good for therapy. I think I'm a firm believer that nature can sense the way that you are feeling. for Example, I might go out for a walk in the woods with people who don't know anything or feel uncomfortable in the woods. You won't see any deer or anything where they just seem to understand people are comfortable and relaxed. I also know people that do therapy or metal women who do therapy with horses, whether. Where the horses will react to anyone who's stressed and uptight. so the horse will not let you ride it. So the person is forced to calm themselves down to have a relationship with this horse and ride it, which again, is nature in a way, naturally calming people down. So I think that. I'm sure bee therapy is a thing and, and those kind of things. I think there's a lot of truth in it and, and I'm sure people laugh at it, but, you know, I think it's great.

Lee: Yeah, we, we gave it a go. Apparently it's big in sort of Eastern Europe, Slovenia and places like this. And they basically put the hives in this. They call it an appy pod. So you go into this, essentially a glamping pod, but they put it.

Tom Radford: Yeah.

Lee: And you can feel, you can feel the vibrations. You can, you know, the pheromones and you can feel the, you know, hear the buzzing. And it was. Me and Paul went and did it and. And we fell asleep. It was that relaxing. And I saw that.

About 10% of British honey wheat is actually from British hives

And then I saw your post about honey and whether what we actually buy in the supermarket is honey. Do you want to tell us a bit about.

Tom Radford: Well, yes. so I'm working on a project with a friend of mine called Plan B's, which is about. Well, initially it's about wild bees because obviously anyone knows the amount of invertebrates we've lost in this country of all kinds. But, when you buy stuff in the supermarket, look at the back of the jar and if it says, a blend of not EU and non EU honeys. And essentially what you've got is sugar syrup with a little bit of honey in it. And they don't call it honey flavoured syrup the same way that we would maple syrup. It wasn't real. They call it honey. And it isn't, which is. Which is, to my view is fraud. about 10% of the honey wheat in this country is actually from British hives. genuine honey. I mean, obviously there is a cost involved with producing honey and so honey is m. Real honey is more expensive. but yeah, a lot of it's just absolute crap. And the thing is that real honey, I mean, is it. First of all, it doesn't ever go off. It's, it's a fantastic substance, it's full of all kinds of goodness. I mean, we import manuka honey from New Zealand at a great expense. And some of these jars, Manuka, I've seen them, 100, 200 pounds a jar. Whereas British heather honey, which you'll definitely get in Scotland, is just as good, but it just hasn't got the same advertising behind it. And it's incredibly good. There's all kinds of, I mean, I don't know what all the different things are, antioxidants and things that are in honey, but it's extremely good for you and it's extremely delicious. And it's another British industry which has been knocked by the big supermarkets who just go in there and, and I mean we probably couldn't produce enough honey for demand. But at least I try and encourage people to try and buy a pot of British locally produced honey where they can. And from a health perspective, I mean I, because I'm trying to sort of eat as much British produce as I can. This year I eat almost exclusively honey instead of sugar and I, and I, I'm sure it's one of the reasons I feel better, you know, so.

Lee: Definitely, yeah, yeah. Now, I mean I took to having like, I don't know whether this is right or wrong, but having like honey in my coffee rather than sugar, just put honey in there. Now probably because it's like you say, it's probably not proper honey. It's the squeezy stuff that you get in the. In asda. But no, I am, I haven't seen your post. I'm I'm gonna sample some of the local. Go and go out and find some proper honey because again, it had never really occurred to me before because it just says honey on the labour. She go. It's just, it's just honey. And it's not why it's terrible because

Tom Radford: it should actually say, you know, honey flavoured substance, honey flavoured syrup, honey flavoured but not honey. I can't believe it's not honey. Well, it isn't, but I mean in Scotland you'll do fine. And also, there's a lot of evidence to suggest that if you eat local honey to the area you're in, then if you have things like, you know, hay fever and any sort of allergies and stuff around local plants, you are eating something which is from that same environment. So technically it's better for you. I mean, I'm sure that's a controversial statement. A Lot of these things are. But, yeah, and, and, it's not that expensive. And also for me, something is very important to me is supporting local British industries and local small British. So, yeah, by all means, go and buy a pot of honey today from your local.

Lee: I will try and, yeah, source some honey and we'll post it online.

Your walks end in the pub and I think there's something about that

You say that you're obviously doing these walks in nature. I love the fact that your walks end in the pub and.

Tom Radford: Of course, of course.

Lee: But I think there's something. All right, yes, you can have a pint or, you know, what have you, but I think there's something about that that people can enjoy. You know, it's almost. You can continue the conversation. It's still part of that slowing down. It's still almost part of community. So I like. Was that part of your thinking or was it just have a beer after you've gone foraging?

Tom Radford: Both, of course. But, No, I, I, I was thinking, I was saying the other day that, you know, when I was 30 years old, did I want to make friends with strangers? Not really. At the age of 53, I love making friends with strangers and I like hearing their storeys. People come on my walks because they want to learn about foraging or because they've seen me online, so they probably want to get to know me as well. Find that, you know, a couple of beers is the way to open up. M, I. There's a lot of vilification, on the line online and stuff about drinking at the moment. And I get, of course there are dangers with drinking and everything else, but I come from a culture where the pub, and sadly, a lot of them are dwindling away in rural areas is a very important thing. I always call it your other living room. And not just for blokes, I mean, for anybody. I mean, just it's, it's, it's you, if you are. There's a lot of people in the countryside who are quite isolated and so going to a place, you know, the way to use a pub is to go and sit at the bar and talk to the people in there and that's, that's one thing I love to do. And so when people come on the walks with me, we sit down and so we'll have a couple of pints. Sometimes I can't get rid of them. We're going to sort of five or six. I hope you're not driving, because we can. I always, I tend to always go to a place where I can just go and slink off and fall asleep in my van in the car park, which was fine. But, but it is, it is lovely. And also I keep it simple. You see a lot of foraging, and outdoor stuff and it's all horses for courses, but something's some of these very sort of, of wellness, or you know, orientated and it's all sort of daisy chains and you know, let's eat something really, really healthy and then, you know, have a glass of elder flour and, and that's fine for some people, but for me a walk to a pub or to and from a pub is, is something that has always been a part of my life, something I've always done with my friends. And as I said before, I've reached out to a couple of, blokes in the area for me who are going through similar sort of, you know, not seeing the kids and stuff. They just want to come for a walk and then end up at a pub for a point. Yeah, they don't have to talk about anything, just, just the fact that it's, it's just a comfortable thing and, and I say a couple of pints can sometimes loosen you up a bit if you're, if you're nervous or unsociable or. So, I, I'm not saying everyone go out and get wasted, but I, I will, I will, you know, I will die on the hill of not being able to have a beer.

Lee: No, I think this, you're right. There's something very social about it and especially in, I say especially in Dorset, especially in many parts of the uk, but I just know some of the country pubs indoors obviously haven't lived there most of my life and yes, I am down seeing my mum in in June. So I might seek you out for a walk and do some, do some foraging. I think we're down beginning of July so I might, I'll tap you up about that and see whether we can do a, a walk and see what we, so we find is, have you ever accidentally terrified someone by casually just eating something out of a hedge?

Tom Radford: Someone terrified me. I, I did a walk in in Purbeck last autumn. I do walks with the pig Hotels and we were doing a walk down on the beach and this bloke shows me this leaf. He goes, watch this. And he's chewing and there's a great bite mark out of this leaf. I can't even see what leaf it is because he's eaten most of it. I, I, I said to him, I am insured, but Please, you know, please say that, I tend not to terrify people. I mean, one of the funniest things is people just obsess with the fact that everything's got dog piss on it. They can, they're convinced that everything's covered in dogweed and they're looking for reasons not to eat it. You know, and old don't eat blackberries, they've got maggots in them and all this. And I think, you know, the most dangerous thing in the world is stress. I mean, and I appreciate that, you know, knowledge is power, but if you're constantly stressing about everything you do, you're actually doing yourself a lot more harm than just eating the bloody BlackBerry. And a BlackBerry is full of vitamins and all sorts of other things that really good for you. So, I, I, I try to encourage people to try things. You, you people, they fall into two cats. You either get someone who's bitten your hand off before you've even explained it's edible, or you get some people who just simply will not do it. Yeah. and of course I say, because I do this death or dinner thing, I mean, I tend to sometimes like that particular walk. For example, I did a recce in the morning and found a death cap. So I thought, well, we'll finish the walk with that. And it was at the time when everyone was talking about this murder in Australia, you know, with the beef weddings. So I finished with the death cap. And of course it's an innocuous looking thing. And, and everyone's like, you know, and I think that's, that, that, that is lovely because you have to make people aware that you do have to pay attention to identification and stuff. But then I always say, you know, if you know about wild garlic, you know about blackberries, you know about hazelnuts and chestnuts, and you probably know what a field mushroom looks like. You're five in already.

Lee: Yeah.

Tom Radford: And there's, it's not that scary. You just have to just remind yourself, you know, of, certain processes to go through when you identify a plant because, you know, m, more of it's edible than isn't. And, and of the stuff that isn't edible either it's inedible as it just doesn't taste very nice or will give you a tummy upset. And then there are a smaller group like hemlock and stuff, which will end you in a horrible way.

Lee: Yeah.

Do you find that going on your walks or people that contact you attracts a mix

Do you find that going on your walks or people that contact you? Is it mainly I'm gonna say men hunter gatherer men or. Or is it women? Do you find who. What's. Is there a balance or.

Tom Radford: Well, I mean, you don't want to blow your own trumpet, do you? But that seems to be a mix of both. and often it's couples. People tend to be. I mean, I sometimes have, you know, teenagers on the walks. But mostly it's, people in about sort of 30, up, quite a lot of women, who are in the 30s and 40s, 50s, or older. I think people have a universal interest in this. I think since COVID people have had an interest in getting out and about and doing things. Perhaps people who are slightly more patient. I mean, the people that I always say that I've probably seen, I don't know, hundreds and hundreds of people on these walks and there hasn't been a single decade on any of them. So that's, that's.

Lee: That's quite an accolade because there's a lot of. About.

Tom Radford: Exactly. Obviously people look at what I do online, I suppose in my. I always say the more that you are yourself, the more that you attract people who like you. Yeah. and the people that come on my walk, the funny, irreverent. You know, they'll be usually the first ones in with the innuendos and all this kind of thing. and they're just patient people and they care about nature and they. I mean, what's great about it is they often make new friends and, and golf and do things together as a result coming on the walk. But it isn't a particular demographic. I mean, you know, you do get some very, One of my favourite moments, a m. Woman who actually wrote on, On. On. On. On the comments. Not even in the. In the. In the DMs. And I don't know where she was or how old she was, but she just. Just this one line, you can forage my bush anytime. which I, I just said, well, that's very generous, madam, but on this occasion I must decline. No, it's not a specific group of people. I mean, it's just nice people. I think people that take the time to care about nature and want to get involved in it generally are just more considered and they're easygoing and you don't really get people who are uptight. Occasionally you'll get someone who's a real know it all. And, we had one girl who's about 11 years old with her mother had good knowledge. This girl. I mean, she knew the Latin name of every single plant, but it was slightly annoying to start with, but I actually then said, you know, actually this is quite funny, you know, because we were like, you know, we were trying to catch her out at that point. but, yeah, people, people have got mixed knowledge. Some people don't know anything at all, some people literally not in a BlackBerry. And some people have decent knowledge as well. and so that's, that's, it's all fun. It's a great community of people and online as well. I get lots of lovely people, people asking about plants or who just feel inspired, people who say that they've had the courage to do it because of watching what I've done. And that's always a massive comment. And I, I'm not precious about knowledge. I. People to learn.

Lee: Well, that brings us up to.

If someone wanted to reconnect with nature tomorrow, where would you suggest going

My last question was if someone listening wanted to reconnect with nature tomorrow but didn't have a clue where to start, where would you tell them to go?

Tom Radford: Well, I always say that with nature, the thing to do is to start with the most obvious things. For example, there are plants people know that they don't realise are edible. So dock leaves, clover, dandelions, so these kind of things, those things are already edible. And with mushrooms, you want to start with the most obvious ones. There's a mushroom called chicken in the woods. I mean, if you've never seen it, just look it up. You can't really mistake it for anything. It's like a Sainsbury's bag nailed to a tree. Okay. you know, things like, parasol mushrooms and, you know, field mushrooms and things like that. So you start off with a few things you already know and you've now found out those are edible. And before you know it, you've got 10 or 15 things. And then you then decide, right? You know, obviously you throw in your blackberries and your, you know, wild garlic and stuff like that you've got. And you then decide, well, do I want to know more and go down the rabbit hole this, or am, I comfortable knowing I've got some things and, and I think it comes down to which, again, to a mental health point, it comes down to the empowerment of it. You know, if you're quite nerdy like me, and you just want to get, you know, you want to learn more things, and you, and you want to try them then, then find out more. But you, I think more people, when they go out in the countryside, it just, it just looks like a load of grass and bushes, but, you know, it doesn't Take long to learn 10 or 15 things and then suddenly you feel, you feel clever, you know, you feel, I'm going to bore people at dinner parties with this now. so you. And I think that's, that's the way into it. And once you know something is edible and you can look it up to prove it, I would say also in terms of technology, you, ah, mentioned Google. Google Lens is actually very good. okay. But it's, it gives you a leg up and you can then go, right, okay, I think we're there, almost there. Or I now can do further research. But if you're out and about, I think it's better than any of these apps because the apps are far too complicated and that with mushrooms they're hopeless. and Russians, something you do not want to get wrong. So, that's definitely another way as well. But it, and then also it's not something you can learn from books. You have to get out there and smell things and, and look at them and get a sense of them as opposed to just looking at it in a book or on a website.

Lee: But that's all part of that reconnection is, as we were saying, Tom, thank you so much for giving up your time. If people want to get in touch with you, either just for a chat or look at your social media or book a walk or what have you. How. What's the best way to get hold of you?

Tom Radford: well, I do have a website called eattecountry.com although as everyone always says about their website, it's a work in progress. But it does have links to walks if they're coming up. usually the place to find me M is Instagram or Facebook. Eat the country on there. You'll see what I do that obviously you can DM me. I'm always happy to talk to people about frauding and stuff. and then I say there are walks, I advertise them and I might have like anything, a link tree at the top that takes you to various things that I'm involved with. And yeah, I just want more people to. I'm not saying everybody go, go out and eat everything in the wild, but I'm always keen for people to learn, to feel empowered and to pass information like this onto children and stuff like that. Because obviously dangerous plants and just people feeling more connected to nature. And. And so I did one walk and someone sort of stopped me and said, you know, you do realise this is a wellness experience. And I thought, yes, modern phrase, what are you talking about? But but they said that they just felt relaxed and happy, that they were. That they were in they. That they were with someone who knew what to do and knew what was going on. And so they felt looked after and comfortable. So. Yeah, and the more the merrier. I'm always happy to, set up walks and private walks and things like that. People want to come along, or. Usually a lot of people just contact me, and I happen to be in the area, so we meet up for a walk in a pint. And, you know, I don't charge people for things like that, so.

Lee: Yeah, that sounds perfect. Like I say, I'm. I'm down start of July, so I will most likely tap you up. And, we could maybe, Yeah, have a pint and eat some wild garlic.

Tom Radford: Well, not in July, but, other things to eat in July. with the way the weather's all over the place at the moment, you'll probably be finding blackberries by then. but I envy you being in Loch Lomond. I know it well. I've done, the West Highland way twice.

Lee: Oh, nice.

Tom Radford: Okay.

Lee: Well, we're just off the West Highland Way near Drimmond Drummond.

Tom Radford: Brilliant. I mean, such a. If anyone wants to do a fun thing in Scotland and they're quite energetic, then that's a wonderful walk today. The weather's obviously rubbish, but, And you live in a beautiful part of the world and. Which I love dearly, so I envy you for that. But, yes, come down. Come for a walk. It'd be great.

Lee: Nice one. In the meantime, I will do my homework and find some local honey.

Tom Radford: Do that, do that, and shout about it online. You know, support your local honey producer.

Lee: Nice one, Tom. Thank you so much for giving out your time. It's been a pleasure.